This episode was recorded at the 2025 Petfood Forum in Kansas City, Missouri.
This episode was recorded at the 2025 Petfood Forum in Kansas City, Missouri.
Guests introduce themselves and their backgrounds (00:59)
Nicole’s presentation at Petfood Forum was based on two surveys her company conducted in March and April 2025, asking 1200+ dog parents and 1200+ cat parents about species-specific decisions they make for pet nutrition and care, focused on novel proteins. They asked which novel proteins of a comprehensive list would pet parents be willing to offer their pet a sample of as an ingredient in a pet food. Options ranged from bison and elk to alligator, ostrich, insects, and cultivated meat. From there, the surveys asked what other drivers and purchase considerations were important and if pet parents would be willing to pay more for foods containing those novel proteins. (8:06)
Nicole goes on to define novel proteins and discusses consumer familiarity with that term. She also explains why novel proteins might be in demand as a pet food ingredient. Allison notes that there is interest in the carbon footprint of novel proteins as well. (11:14)
Survey results indicated that dog parents were most interested in bison, rabbit, and elk, while cat parents were most interested in rabbit, bison, and quail. Nicole and Bob talk about technical challenges and opportunities in the novel protein space, including supply chain, palatability, nutraceutical aspects, and raw product variability. They also discuss if certain novel proteins are better suited to a particular form of food (kibble, wet, minimally processed, etc.). (15:06)
Nicole and Allison talk about how companies might evaluate the social and environmental impacts of a novel protein ingredient. Allison mentions her company uses an ingredient database called HowGood that measures ingredients against eight different impact categories. (24:04)
The panel talks about the humanization of pets and how pet parents align their values with purchases for their pet. Bob talks about some of the nutraceutical trends he’s observed. Allison notes that Gen Z and millennial consumers are very aware and concerned about their pets’ health and wellness. (27:37)
Nicole talks about current marketing trends, including video format as a source for pet parents to get inspiration about pet health and wellness. The group then dives into the topic of influencers, misinformation, and the role that science can play in providing accurate information to consumers. (35:31)
Panelists share their take-home thoughts. (45:39)
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Scott Sorrell (00:08):
Good evening everyone, and welcome to the Real Science Exchange, the pubcast we're leading scientists and industry professionals meet over a few drinks to discuss the latest ideas and trends in animal nutrition. Today we're at 2025 Pet Food Forum, and we're continuing our conversation with key speakers here at the conference and our series of companion, animal related podcast. Today we're gonna be reviewing a presentation given by Nicole Hill from Marketplace. The topic of the talk that she gave yesterday was Novel proteins and today's pet parents. What's next? So, welcome Nicole. This is not your first time to the hub, so welcome back. You must like it here.
Nicole Hill (00:47):
I do. It's a great, it's a great place to be with a lot of great people, so thanks for having me back, Scott. No,
Scott Sorrell (00:51):
It's great. Great to have you. You're a great guest. What I like though I know how great you are. Tell the, tell the audience how great you are. Nicole, tell us a little bit about yourself.
Nicole Hill (00:59):
Well, I'm the VP of strategy and innovation at Marketplace. We serve the pet and human nutrition markets with strategy, research, branding, and marketing. And the central piece of research that informed the talk I gave yesterday was from our next in research offering where every year we conduct a survey of over a thousand pet parents nationwide and look to really identify what they want, what their unmet needs are, what they're curious about, and help to tie that to what the industry has to offer and see, you know, where that pet category might be going from from here.
Scott Sorrell (01:35):
Excellent. Now, Nicole, typically here at the Real Science Exchange, we say it takes place in a virtual pub with real drinks. It is 9:00 AM in the morning here, so, so no drinks. So instead what we'd like you to do is tell us a little about your your favorite pet, current pet, just ah,
Nicole Hill (01:49):
Yeah. So my favorite and current pet is Omar. He is a 13-year-old German Shepherd mix. He will be 14 next month, so we're preparing to have a great celebration of his birthday. He's certainly a member of our family. I have two human kids as well, but Omar, we certainly consider him as part of, part of that family unit and an amazing dog. I think he's the best dog in the whole world. I think a lot of other pet parents course probably think that about their pets, but to, to me, he's, he's number one. Yeah,
Scott Sorrell (02:21):
Absolutely. Great. We also then, as our color commentary tater today is Allison Bur from the Pet Sustainability Coalition. Oh, welcome Allison. Glad to have you here. First time at the pub. So, welcome. Yes, thank
Allison Burdick (02:33):
You for having me.
Scott Sorrell (02:34):
Yep. So, if you wouldn't mind, would you just kind of give us a little overview and tell us about Allison. What do we need to know?
Allison Burdick (02:39):
Well, I'm one of two Allisons at PSC. Okay. So that's the one distinguishing factor. But we work at the Pet Sustainability Coalition. I'm a sustainability analyst. I am focused on our ingredients and formulation work and also support some packaging side of things. But PSC is an industry nonprofit. We work with companies across the entire supply chain, including ingredient suppliers, those brands all the way to the retailer.
Scott Sorrell (03:05):
What would you say your mission statement is? What, what is your, your, your role in, in, in life here as, as the pet sustainability coalition?
Allison Burdick (03:13):
Hmm. Helping support businesses through profitable environmental practices. Okay. so really making that business case for sustainability and helping meet companies where they're at on their sustainability goals.
Scott Sorrell (03:25):
Yeah. Perfect. Excellent. Well, thanks again. Co-Host today is Bob Mason. Bob works for Chem as a what a technologist. Bob, I'm not sure exactly know your title, but why don't you tell us all about yourself? Yeah.
Bob Mason (03:40):
I've been with Falcon for about 15 years. That entire time. I've worked with applying encapsulated ingredients into a variety of food systems. I've been with the pet team for about eight years now, helping translate a lot of the human technologies into the pet food space. So I do a lot of work, learning about a wide variety of different processes, ingredients, all that work. Eric's done a lot of work with me on translating what human food is into what pet food is and all the unique intricacies that come with that. So that's been pretty fun and been really interesting. A lot of varied things on translating things from Oh yeah, we're talking about beef and in human food, that's steak and hamburger and in pet food, that means the whole animal and what that means. So I've done a lot of work with proteins in general, so I'm really excited to talk about novel proteins and like how we define that and what that means for the future.
Scott Sorrell (04:33):
Yeah. Excellent. Bob and Allison, I'm gonna come back to you. I didn't ask you your favorite pet, but Bob, give us your favorite pet.
Bob Mason (04:41):
So, I don't know about favorite pet. We've got a menagerie at home. I have a dog, Pam Bailey. She's a big doofus. And then we have two cats, four chickens, two ducks and a tortoise. Oh,
Scott Sorrell (04:51):
You do have menagerie. Yeah. That's almost a farm actually. Yeah.
Bob Mason (04:55):
The tortoise is the longest me living member of our family. She's been, well, he's been with us for 15 years now. That's amazing.
Scott Sorrell (05:03):
Wow. Yeah. That's incredible. Excellent. . Allison, tell us about your pet. So,
Allison Burdick (05:07):
Here's the thing. Huh? I don't have a pet right now. Yes. They said it wasn't required for the job, but I am a dog and to many, and I do have a lot of plants. Okay. But I think 2025 is the year it's my goal to adopt a dog. Yeah. This summer
Scott Sorrell (05:22):
Or fall. Got a breed in mind?
Allison Burdick (05:24):
No, I think just affectionate. Yeah. Good. And a snuggler. Okay. This thing is what I'm looking for. Yeah.
Scott Sorrell (05:29):
Yeah. . Alright. Nicole, give us kind of a, a treetop level. Look at the presentation that you gave yesterday and what were some of the key elements you talked about Dr. Altham? something that a lot of our customers may not know is that Alchem is the world's largest manufacturer of MSM marketed under the brand name Opti, MSM. Just tell us a little bit about that and how it's being used in the pet food industry.
Speaker 5 (05:59):
It's got MSM or methyl methane is a sulfur compound that has been used for decades in animal supplements, primarily with equine canine and to some degree within the feline supplements. In fact, the original company was the first member of NASE or the National Animal Supplement Council. So this is manufactured in the US with one of our proprietary processes and distillation, and resulting in a 99.9% purity. So we have focused on safety quality and ensuring that you get the best product. And with decades of use, this is a very trusted brand by veterinarians and pet parents across the world.
Scott Sorrell (06:47):
You know, one of the key things points you made there is that a lot of the imported products are made by a different process. And I've seen actual pictures of our product compared to a competing product that was imported and they looked entirely different. Can you talk a little bit about what differences a customer might see if they look at, at our products under the microscope?
Speaker 5 (07:06):
We have a proprietary process, so I'm not going into all the specifics, but what you would see if you looked at a microscope is we have a prill and that drives off all of the moisture that is in that particular product through the distillation process. A lot of materials on the international market is through crystallization and within the crystallization process, you can, you can trap impurities such as heavy metals or other types of components or water within those inclusions or within those crystals. By using our methodology of distillation and creating a prill, you're able to ensure the correct temperature, a distillation, and maintain that temperature and get rid of all of these other components that may be in the process.
Scott Sorrell (07:58):
A-P-M-S-M 99% pure. Thanks, Eric. Alright.
Nicole Hill (08:06):
Yeah. So when we think about novel proteins from a consumer lens we dove deeply into the consumer perspective on what novel proteins sounded appealing to them as something they might consider in their pet's food. What are other values drivers like eco-friendliness, sustainability that motivate their purchase decisions? And then also from a marketing standpoint, where are they getting their information and inspiration about the pet health and nutrition decisions they make and where are they shopping? So we really look at it from a variety of angles in addition to pet need, states that drive purchase the ingredients apart from protein, the nutraceuticals that pet parents associate with positive health benefits for their pet, and really a pretty comprehensive look at what is the current state of that us pet parents attitudes, preferences, and decision making process when it comes to selecting food, treat supplements for dogs and cats.
Nicole Hill (09:08):
So all of the presentation was rooted in two surveys that we conducted this March and April. So very, very, very fresh data. We surveyed over 1200 dog parents and we surveyed over 1200 cat parents specifically about those species specific decisions that they make for, again, pet nutrition and care. In that, one of the things that we, we always look at when we're talking about anything novel, anything new, anything unfamiliar is are pet parents willing to sample it? Are they willing to try it? Because we all know if your pet's not going to eat something they're, you're not going to continue purchasing that product. So we started with trial. What proteins, if a pet food were made with that, would you be likely to offer a sample to your pet? Let me rephrase that, which pet pro, let me rephrase that yet again.
Nicole Hill (10:06):
We asked them which proteins of a pretty comprehensive list of novel proteins from you know, bison and elk to alligator and ostrich to insects and cultivated meat of these proteins, which would you be likely to offer your pet a sample of pet food made with that protein? And so we really got a, a picture of what each dog, parents and cat parents would be inclined to offer their pet. And then from there we dove into other drivers and purchase consideration as well as what would you be willing to pay more for? Because as we know at the end of the day to Allison's point, any play, whether it's in novel proteins sustainability or an overlap between the two, there has to be a commercial case for it. Ultimately, you know, a lot of businesses have values that are driving part of their mission, but at the end of the day, in order for the business to be sustainable, to stick around, they need to be able to have it be a commercially viable direction that they're headed in. Quick
Scott Sorrell (11:05):
Question, what makes a protein novel? What is that definition at what levels become novel? And then how did you select the ones that you, you put on the list?
Nicole Hill (11:14):
Yeah. So novel protein from our vantage point is any protein that a pet parent or the pet industry at large would consider let me restate that. A novel protein would be considered anything that is essentially new or less common less, maybe less accessible or less scalable than your common proteins, which common proteins I would consider beef, chicken, pork, things that the consume Turkey to eat some degree eat Yes. Things that the consumer eats. Yeah. But also some of the new innovations that are percolating in the industry that haven't fully converted to large scale commercial production. There are some niche brands that offer, for instance, insect protein-based food. Yeah. Or brands that are working in the cultivated meat space. But I would say the average consumer is not necessarily aware of those where you ask, you know, a man on the street, a woman on the street where proteins are in your pet's food. Yeah. Most of them are going to say chicken, beef, pork, that sort
Scott Sorrell (12:15):
Of thing. Would you consider co-products novel or would a consumer
Nicole Hill (12:19):
I, I think so if, depending on how they're labeled. Right. Yeah. So so much of it comes down to packaging and what's on the package, both the front of pack, the, the claims, the attributes that are in the, the product. But also one of the top considerations a pet parent has when they're choosing a pet food is what is that protein source? So depending on how, what that co-product is allowed to be labeled as, that to me is going to indicate to that pet parent in their minds whether they think of it as something novel or familiar.
Scott Sorrell (12:50):
Yeah. So I don't know if it's in your survey or not, but the one question that's kind of top of mind for me is, is why novel proteins? Why, why would you consider that feeding that to your pet? Or, or would a a pet food manufacturer consider putting it into their, their food?
Nicole Hill (13:07):
Sure. Well, and I think this goes to a lot of what Allison and her team, you know, champion and explore businesses are looking at different protein sources for a variety of reasons. They're looking at it to meet pet dietary directional needs. So pets that have maybe digestive issues or gut health problems that maybe some of the more common proteins don't, don't sit with them well. Or it could be that businesses are looking for to diversify their supply chain and look at different sources that can help them to produce different lines. Not even necessarily to replace the primary options, but to offer different specialized diets and, and extend their product lines with a range of things that can again diversify their supply chain and sourcing practices. Alison, I know from a sustainability standpoint, I'm sure there are reasons why different, you know, insect proteins, I think there is a case that insect protein brands make for sustainability. What's your vantage point on, you know, what are those sustainability drivers you hear people talking about in the context of novel proteins?
Allison Burdick (14:19):
Yeah, there has been a lot of discussion and also regulation recently globally around reducing greenhouse gas emissions and looking at your supply chain to do so. Especially when it comes to ingredient sourcing and your ingredient footprint. And I think there are a lot of innovations and research going into novel and new proteins. You know, can we look at the carbon footprint of an insect protein measured against conventional beef and figure out how we can reduce particularly scope three emissions in our supply chain through formulation. It is complicated. There's always some nuance in many different levers and impact categories and factors that go into it, but certainly having to explore avenues
Nicole Hill (15:06):
And from a technical standpoint, when companies are looking at the potential to develop products with novel proteins, you know, from our survey among dog parents, bison, rabbit, and elk were the top three proteins that were in that cohort of novel proteins be surveyed on that that dog parents were most interested in offering as a a, a pet food sample to their dog. On the cat front it was rabbit, bison and quail. And then of course there are fish things like silver carp or coppi, the invasive carp species that, that we see in the Mississippi and Illinois rivers. Things of that nature. I'm, I'm curious from a product development standpoint, when you know, consumers want one thing or they say they want one thing, I also contend, you know, that when we do these surveys we always, it always helps us look at relative preference, right?
Nicole Hill (16:03):
I think it, it paints a, a, a clear picture on that front. However when consumers answer a survey in many cases, they're really answering from the best version of themselves, a little bit of an aspirational version of themselves. Would I pay more for this? Would I, would I switch foods to, you know, align with this objective? And while I, I do see proof points that say, yes, that is the case. It's not always in direct proportion to how they respond when they are self-reporting. So we, we see some of this movement and interest and openness, but again, those drivers vary and ultimately at the end of the day, they can't make that purchase if the product isn't there on shelves. So what are those technical challenges or opportunities across the novel protein space that, that you've witnessed along the way?
Bob Mason (16:55):
Yeah, so that there's a layer of questions there. Oh,
Nicole Hill (16:57):
Yes.
Bob Mason (16:58):
Top of mind it comes to, I know supply chain is definitely there, whereas the traditional meats, it's a very established supply chain on where the meat comes from. And to there, there's additional sustainability concerns on, okay, we're worried about feeding people, but we're also worried about feeding the animals. So what can we do to maximize the value of every cow that we harvest from, or every pig. And a lot of that conversation comes down to are like better utilization of organ meats, better utilization of products before they have to go into like meal manufacturer or rendering. And that's a sustainable, there's a sustainability conversation there as well, because there's a lot of extra emissions and everything that go into the rendering process that, so if we could get value out of the products pre-render, that's a good conversation for everyone all around. And to specifically answer your question, yeah, there's just, like you mentioned, bison and elk, and I've heard a lot of people talk about kangaroo.
Bob Mason (17:56):
It's good to get proteins outta those animals, but in terms of like a farm setup, there's less of it available. And even in terms of like a development standpoint, the proteins tend to be a little bit more difficult to work with. I know, especially like kangaroo as an example, is a much more challenging protein to work with compared to your traditional, like beef or pork and bison's kind of similar to beef, but it's different enough that you have to take different considerations into the palatability, a little bit different between the different animals. And then you also have to manage the nutraceutical aspects because they're a little bit different. So we have to make sure that we're delivering the best possible product to our pets as well as making sure that it'll actually run consistently. And even to that end, because they're almost more of a wild animal and less of a, like a farmed animal, there's a lot more variability, like lot to lot for lack of like a humanizing term of the animals. So we have to pay much more attention to the supply chain and making sure that each complete and balanced diet is actually delivering what we want it to be delivering so that there's a safety aspect as well.
Nicole Hill (19:04):
From a format standpoint, are there pet food formats that are, that work better for specific types of novel proteins? You mentioned, you know, bison or kangaroo for instance, like, is kibble ideal? Is wet food, fresh pet food? Because we see a correlation with consumers who are open and interested in novel proteins are also those who are less likely to feed Kim kibble as part of their pet's total diet. So I'm curious if the formulation possibilities align with what those audiences are more inclined to feed.
Bob Mason (19:42):
Yeah, I definitely see what you're saying where people are more likely to buy those specific novel proteins when they're called out, that puts you more into a more premium category of products. So you start transitioning from kibble into canned, into canned into like your minimally processed diets or even going as far as like the freeze dried diets. The short answer is each particular format has its own pros and cons. So when any kind of extrusions involved, you have to basically reset up it with the different proteins. And then coming back to the, the variance aspect, as you deal with these proteins in a more whole aspect, that variance really starts playing into how they want to process. So a minimally processed diet, I feel like would probably be the quote unquote easiest in terms of processing, because there's very little processing involved. But to that end, that's also the one that's probably the highest risk of making sure that okay, it's consistent, it's safe. Whereas if you go down to extrusion on the other end, I think I'm certainly not an expert will Henrys, we're floating around, we can try to track him down, but the extrusion angle, at least you can add more consistency into it. So it, it really varies. There's challenges for all of them. Whereas I think as you get into the more premium space, the challenges are more noticeable, but it varies protein to protein process to process.
Nicole Hill (21:10):
So when when we looked at these consumers who we said are identified as folks who are more likely to purchase a product made with a novel protein, regardless of which specific protein that is they also tended to prioritize eco consciousness, giving back, paying it forward, that type of thing. And interestingly enough, I thought something I thought was interesting about the subgroup who was inclined to reward to consider cultivated meat, they also tended to be people who prioritized all natural. Which again, I know that that is not a claim we make on packaging, but it is a perception that consumers have and that that they, they associate with products they associate with brands. And how they define that really is what, what matters in their shopping experience, recognizing that it's not what brands say but what customers look for. But a lot of that also to them associates with minimally processed or direct from, you know, as, as direct as possible. And even some of the, the limited ingredient pieces. What would you say you've found on the minimally processed front in terms of novel proteins? Are there any that, that are better suited to that type of product?
Bob Mason (22:31):
From a stability standpoint, I feel like everyone would prefer to work with a more traditional, like muscle mm-hmm . And then it gets more complicated as you wander into the organ meats because they're a little bit harder to handle. We at Balam have a few technologies that we even like to talk about to improve, like the handle ability of that material. But then from there, from the organ meats, I feel like then you start getting into like the insect proteins that's probably a much less understood mm-hmm . Protein in terms of what do we do with it. I know I was just talking to Jessica Starkey from Auburn yesterday about some of the work that they've been doing with the insects and some of the like pros to it and some of the challenges that come in with, 'cause it's such a different raw material mm-hmm . Compared to, like, a lot of our knowledge comes from more traditional like meat science.
Bob Mason (23:17):
And as you start differentiating and diverging from standard skeletal muscle meat, it's just starts getting more and more challenging on what to do with it. Like I mentioned, organ meats a couple of times, they're much more difficult to handle and get into like a nice cohesive diet than compared to like a skeletal muscle. But skeletal muscle, you're in competition with the human food chain. Mm-Hmm . It's much more expensive. Then you start running into challenges based on different issues going on. Like looking at avian flu, well all of a sudden we have a lot less chicken meat available for a little while, so what can we do to build in robustness into the supply chain? Yeah. So it, in terms of like formulating a raw meat based diet, I think it just kind of varies. Mm-Hmm .
Nicole Hill (24:04):
I one of the things that you mentioned is getting back to that like stability in the supply chain and making sure there's a diverse and accessible and scalable supply of things, which again, by nature of these many of these proteins being novel scalability is a consideration, but also there's the sustainability aspect. I'm curious, Allison, what standards should companies consider if they're looking at a novel protein, but want to uphold and maintain a certain sustainability objective that that organization has? What criteria might they need to meet?
Allison Burdick (24:39):
I think if you're looking at it from what social and environmental impacts does your new novel ingredient have, it's important to really look at a lot of different categories. We actually work with a database called How Good it's an ingredient database that measures ingredients against eight different impact categories ranging from water usage to labor labor risk mm-hmm . So, you know, there's tools available to help you make those informed decisions. But really it is looking at what's material, what's most important to your business, what's most important to be included in your product, and then making informed decisions based on the data that's out there
Nicole Hill (25:30):
And what in the, at what point in the process of even considering. 'cause We know there's a lot of r and d work that goes into things that might not, you know, make it to market for one reason or another. And at what point in that product development process and commercialization process should a, an organization connect with like the pet sustainability coalition to audit and evaluate what is the sustainability impact of this formula? Is it when, you know, still in the phase where bench work is happening, is it when they're, you know, in pilot plant mode and doing small initial runs? At what point in that process is it best to connect with you all?
Allison Burdick (26:07):
Really any point? So we can meet you where you're at with, with our tool that we use, how good we can look at and compare single ingredients and their performance scores against each other, including where it's sourced from, if it has any third party certifications like USD organic, regenerative organic global animal partnership, animal welfare standards. But also we can look at a fully formulated product as well. And, you know, is that main protein chicken, do we wanna swap in a fish protein and see how that impacts the entire product itself? And go
Nicole Hill (26:42):
From there. So they can even potentially use that as a tool to inspire some of the direction of new product innovation, especially when perhaps certainly expanding a product line. So again, you might have your leading chicken, beef, pork product offering, but as with any business, a lot of times expanding that offering to either meet some niche needs or address other needs for pets or just other desires for pet parents, especially in cat. I mean, one day your cat likes the food that they're eating and then another day they might not, and there might not be anything that has changed. And pet parents in the CAT space specifically, you're always seeking to add variety to their pet's meals and, and treating occasions. And I think in dog two, you know, we've talked about previously, Scott, the pet's bull is no longer a single food plate or bull.
Nicole Hill (27:37):
It's kibble plus wet, plus maybe fresh plus maybe a food topper. And pet parents are bringing variety to their pet's diets through what I consider kind of their taking the personalization of their pet's nutrition into their own hands, whether it's through a variety of different food formats or adding toppers, adding supplements, that type of thing. One of the things that we think about when sustainability is considered when product development is, is happening is one, what obviously what does this deliver to the pet from a nutritional standpoint that's the, the ultimate priority. But two, how does it help the pet parent align their values with the products they're purchasing? 'cause We're seeing so much more in, in terms of values driven purchases. And while the humanization of pets is not a new trend, we've seen that happening for over a decade. What I see as kind of the continuation of that is, okay, I'm looking for these ingredients and nutraceuticals in my own diet in my own supplements, in my own foods.
Nicole Hill (28:46):
And as we've seen in the beverage space a lot in, in beverage right now. And then looking for that in their pets. One of the things that I think is interesting is how much pet parents associate one antioxidants with a positive correlation for their pet's health. Two the continued growth of pro pre and Postbiotics. So pro obviously having the, the greatest visibility, the greatest awareness prebiotics having grown substantially over the years and postbiotics continuing to rise. There's also positive associations and research that pet parents are doing themselves around vitamins and minerals zinc, et cetera. And I think it's, it's really interesting to see the, the time people are spending to research not just novel proteins, but also other nutraceuticals that can inform their, their pet's holistic nutrition. From a product development standpoint, what are you seeing brands, you know, asking about from a nutraceutical standpoint in terms of formulating it into that main part of the pet's diet or even in pet supplements and, and other formats?
Bob Mason (29:59):
Yeah, I feel like, again, another complicated question.
Nicole Hill (30:02):
I like complicated questions, but you're excellent at answering them. So so it works out.
Bob Mason (30:07):
Yeah. So it kind of comes down to like a dual thought process. I think fundamentally on the one side, especially in the complete and balanced realm, there are pretty established rules on what you should put in, what you can front of pack claims in different levels. So there's a lot less flexibility in pushing certain nutraceuticals over others, whereas the supplement side of the pet food industry is just booming with all these different things that, okay, the pet parents think whether they're right or wrong, it doesn't really matter. They think that I need to start adding this, or I need to start adding this to my animal's diet. And the foods aren't really there to claim it, or it just, it's so challenging to put together a new formula formula and there's a certain amount of risk of trying to develop formulas for specific call outs for mm-hmm . Like one specific part of the industry. Whereas the supplement industry is filling all those gaps. So the different formats, as you mentioned, there could be even be a topper or like a powder that you add, or even just a straight up supplement chew that you're giving on a daily basis. So that's where I see a lot of that growth trying to hit the individual trends of, especially like the nutrient trends that we start kind of see trickle down from the human side of the business.
Nicole Hill (31:22):
In terms of those front pack claims, obviously they're regulatory considerations always but we are seeing an increase of not just preference for if, you know, if I'm choosing between two cat foods, two dog foods and generally, you know, have the same features, benefits but one has a very clear eco-friendly, sustainably oriented position or the pet sustainability coalition seal. We are seeing that people are more likely not just to purchase, but there is that predisposition to pay more for products that have that alignment. And obviously that that ties into both protein sources. But as you mentioned, everything from labor to water usage and beyond from the need state standpoint, I think we are also seeing that, that, again, that perception that pet parents have, you know, like I mentioned, I have a, a 13-year-old German Shepherd mix.
Nicole Hill (32:23):
As you can imagine, joint health has been top of mind for us his entire life. But especially in his senior years in hip and joint health. And I, I do think that, you know, pet parents are ultimately wanting to first look at what are the benefits they want to provide to their pet as much as possible through their daily nutrition and proactively as much as possible. But so many of those need states end up being need states that are very visible. So it's digestive health, it's skin and code, it's joint health, and then of course, daily wellness, which we, we took a survey a couple years ago about what do you, how do you define daily wellness and or why do you give your pet like a, a supplement in that case? And many of them said like, I don't know if it'll work, but I feel like, you know, the, the odds are that it's going to be net positive relative to it, and my pet is worth it to me to put that intention forward to, you know whether it's in their, their meal or in supplements to, to pay that extra investment even when economic times can be uncertain or tight.
Nicole Hill (33:37):
Pet parents are willing to do that. From a pet sustainability coalition standpoint, have you all, you know, identified anything or collected any data around how much or how much influence there is with pet purchase decisions and willingness to pay for brands and products that align with that sustainability position?
Allison Burdick (33:58):
I definitely think we see it still trending, especially amongst Gen Z and millennials, that they are aware of the products they're purchasing, not only for themselves, but also for their pets, and they're very concerned about their pets health and wellbeing. But a lot of people are aware of their environmental footprint and that also trickles down to our pets. So our pets, our pets consume a lot of protein. Our pets consume a lot of products. And we see that consumers do still care about the environment and their purchasing as it relates to environmental practices. And I think brands are leaning into that as well in a way that's hopefully not greenwashing, you know, making specific claims and having data backed information.
Nicole Hill (34:45):
Yeah. No, that makes sense. And I think with all of it, whether it's novel protein, sustainability you know, you mentioned organ meats, which we surveyed, you know, questions about how does that impact your decision? And it is a net positive impact that most pet parents see when organ meats are included in their pet pet's nutrition, but ultimately they're one. And with novel proteins as well, there needs to be awareness among pet parents that these options are available. The products need to actually be on the shelf, whether it's the digital shelf or in those brick and mortar stores for them to purchase. And then the pet's experience with it has to be positive because at the end of the day, you can have the most sustainable novel, you know, comprehensively nutritious product, but if your pet's not going to eat it, well, what good is it going to do?
Nicole Hill (35:31):
And I think one of the things we're seeing on the marketing front is people are more and more turning to video content, whether it's YouTube or TikTok or even Facebook and Instagram, the video content there to get their information and inspiration about pet nutrition and wellness. So when they're turning to those sources, if you are a consumer brand in that space and you are bringing something new to the table, whether it's a novel protein or a nutraceutical that has less visibility or even a vitamin or mineral that people maybe take for granted, but don't really understand the exact role it plays in their pet's health and wellness or their own those are the things that I suggest brands in the consumer space. You know, when you're looking at your marketing spend and what channels are you spending on, look at those video content platforms and also make sure you know your audience first because the pet audience the pet consumer audience is, is massive, right?
Nicole Hill (36:26):
And there are a ton of different segments within it and different value systems that are, and priorities that are driving purchase. You know, price plays a, a role. Personal values play a role whether you know, the community you live in, we see distinctions between people who live in urban areas and suburban areas and rural areas, and some of the decisions or things that they're more inclined toward. And knowing that consumer and your specific audience helps you to reach them where they're at and make sure that that communication and awareness and education that needs to happen for whatever it is that might be less familiar to pet parents is accessible to them and, and proactively reaching them. And video content is a really great way to tell those longer form stories because it can't always be done in a little, you know, single static display ad getting into the nuances of what makes for a sus a more sustainable pet food.
Nicole Hill (37:19):
And I think that that's just something that consumer brands need to consider, but it's also an opportunity for the B2B space and the organizations that support the industry from all vantage points to put forth consumer education and awareness efforts to make sure people are informed when they're making these choices so that they're not just making a decision about something that might be new or shiny, but that they're making a decision that is the right decision for them, their pet, and, you know, for those values that are that they want to live out in every purchase. My colleague John Copeland on our research team, he often says, consumers vote with their dollar when it comes to things that are truly important. They vote with their dollar. And while they might not always be able to afford every single thing that's important to them, there is that hierarchy of needs.
Nicole Hill (38:07):
There are that there is that priority system. And we see that in the products they purchased from food and supplements and pet, which tends to be one of the more inelastic categories and the ingredients they seek, the, the product formats they purchase and the places they shop. So I'll be really interested to see where, where the category goes from here in Food and Treats and beyond. And certainly suggest that if anyone has curiosities about their specific audience in the consumer space reach out to me, Nicole Hill at Marketplace, or visit our research platform next in research to purchase some of that research to really get a deep dive into those audiences.
Scott Sorrell (38:51):
Nicole, this been an interesting conversation and I'm sitting here listening, you know, kind of along for the ride. My, my background is animal nutrition for production animals. And in, in that space we are very concerned about providing the nutrients that animals require. And it seems like on the companion animal space, it's less about that and it's more about understanding what the consumer thinks the animal needs and, and, and trying to supply that. And so then that goes back to the comment you made about making sure, 'cause 'cause I have my perspective is now I've got an N of one, I've got one consumer at home. And so I test everything that she does, and she does a lot of this research and I'm always, alright honey, so what makes that person an expert or that video or that, you know, and so how do we, my ultimate question is I think that the consumer's not always right in terms of knowing what that animal needs from a nutrient perspective, yet they're trying to understand and they're doing their research. How do they vet these various sources to make sure that they're getting valid information? Right? Yeah. Because there's a lot of fads and a lot of junk information out there. There are,
Nicole Hill (40:05):
And there's certainly a place for for getting that information from a human standpoint, when we think about our own diets and how do we inform the decisions we make in our own, you don't necessarily go to your doctor to build your nutrition plan if you're needing to make adjustments, if you know you're to achieve certain health goals or pre-diabetic or whatever. Usually your doctor refers you to a nutritionist, right? Yeah. In the pet space companion pet, it's, it's different. So how many pet parents have access to a nutrition scientist unless they, you know, work with one or live with one or have one in their family you know, people are navigating things on their own. Yeah. And we're in in the animal space that you're talking about, you know, that is crucial to those operations.
Nicole Hill (40:56):
So nutrition sciences, to your point, very integrated into the operations that produce the beef and the chicken and the pork and, and whatnot that go into these foods. So from a consumer lens it, it really ends up being they either find a brand that they trust. Yeah. A lot of times a brand that's been around for a long time and is established and has a track record of, you know, health and wellness and safety in the food for their, for the pets. But, but again, like to a degree it really is consumers navigating it on their own. They might ask their veterinarian questions, but at the end of the day, you know, as again, for the human space, you don't go to your doctor necessarily to put together here's the dietary plan that that makes sense for you and your proactive wellness and proactive health.
Nicole Hill (41:46):
And just pet parents don't have that access to nutrition scientists without, you know, having someone that they, they know in their friends and family, which veterinarian is the number one place people go for information on their pet's, health, wellness, nutrition friends and family. Number two, after that, it's online searches, so people Google it. Yeah. And that's where they get information. And so that's why responsible brands, in my opinion, also have a responsibility to be proactive about communicating, you know, the background because today's consumer is probably the, has the most access to information that any consumer has had in the history of the world prior and
Scott Sorrell (42:26):
Good and bad.
Nicole Hill (42:27):
And so I think that's where brands have a role to play in making sure that they're informed and aware and have that perspective that can help them make the decisions that are right for them and Right for their pet. Yeah. And not to be led astray by something that is the, you know, hot topic of the moment or you know, something that they see on Facebook and just believe in. But if you know, people are responding and believing what they see on those channels, then I think there's also a responsibility and an opportunity as well to show up there. Yeah. And, and that's why knowing where your consumers are and meeting them there and making sure they have that, that credible science backed information is essential. Yeah.
Scott Sorrell (43:11):
Sounds like a business opportunity for someone. But listen, this has been a great conversation. I think we're getting close to needing to wrap this up. But what I'd like to do is for each of you to kind of think through a couple key takeaways from the conversations that we've had and, you know, talk to the audience out there. What, what are those two things that they need to take from this? So Robert being the co-host and first time here at the Real Science Exchange I would like to start with you if you wouldn't mind, couple key takeaways for the audience. Dr. Alden, with the adoption of fresh frozen refrigerated meat type products, there's a greater demand for pathogen pathogen control. Balms recently created a product called pH Control Systems. Tell me a little bit about that.
Speaker 5 (44:03):
Yeah, so what we have been able to do within the pet Sure Brand and our pH control system is leverage our heritage understanding and unique processes of micro encapsulation to deliver specific ulence that can help control the pH of the finished product and help be a hurdle for pathogenic bacteria growth. This product enhances the texture, maintains the color, maintains and supports shelf life, and helps maintain shelf life while inhibiting the microbial growth of pathogen bacteria. This was originally developed in the human food sector, and so we have translated that from the meat science and human foods safely and effectively into pet foods, ensuring that it is both labeled appropriately and registered for use of pet and specialty pet products.
Scott Sorrell (44:56):
So organic acids have been used for a very long time to control pathogens in meat type products. What makes this pH control system different?
Speaker 5 (45:04):
The uniqueness of this is the microencapsulation and being able to control the release of that acid link into the product over a period of time. Quick release causes changes in the texture, changes in the color loss of moisture in your finished product or the meat batter. And the, by controlling this release, we're able to eliminate those aesthetics as well as the functionality of the protein breakdown.
Bob Mason (45:39):
All right. Yeah, I think really prone to your guys' conversation right now is consumer education is huge, that we're, we're blessed in the fact that we're in an era where consumers want to be educated and they're looking for that information. But to your point, Scott, there's a lot of information out there, but it's not always the most accurate. So I think getting the message out and trying to control the flow, not control the flow of information, but controlling like the actual information. Like to me, influencers have their place, but they're not always experts. So we need to make sure that the kind of correct information and like referenced information and valid information is available for our pet parents to actually find and interact with easily. We don't wanna be on the third page of the Google results because most people don't go past the first page. And I think that is huge, and I think sustainability is going to continue to play a huge role in all these different diet formulations and ingredient selections as we move forward. As, I mean, even this pet food form itself, sustainability has been one of the key topics throughout the day.
Scott Sorrell (46:45):
Great comment, Bob Allison. Yeah. Couple key takeaways for us.
Allison Burdick (46:49):
Yeah. I had the pleasure of seeing Nicole speak at Pet Food forum as well. And so grateful that we have this data and I think it's so important to make data backed decisions when considering novel ingredients and really looking at how can I make the best informed decision making for my formulations. I also think we are gonna continue to see trends in sustainability and now that influences pet parents purchasing decisions. But this is really innovative space and it's really exciting. I'm excited to see the future of some of these novel ingredients and how they, you know, maybe scale up to be bigger players at pet food.
Scott Sorrell (47:25):
Yeah. That is fun. Mm-Hmm . Nicole, great guest. Take us home. Oh,
Nicole Hill (47:30):
Thank you, Scott. It was a pleasure to chat with you all and to see you as always. I think at, at the end of the day, it is about what do pets need, number one, and then what do pet parents want? Number two, and when you already have the capability and knowledge and the nutrition science behind what they need, seeing how you can marry that with what pet parents want from a value standpoint what they're prioritizing, what they feel their pet needs, and making sure that you're living at the intersection of those places is really essential for any formulation. Whether it's with the common proteins that people know and gravitate toward that are still number one, two, and three, or you're looking to expand your product line and introduce some additional variety. I think at the end of the day, you want to meet pet parents where they are while still keeping that health, nutrition and wellness for the pet, obviously. And that safety number one. And I think that marrying those perspectives is essential to the future and the growth in the pet nutrition space.
Scott Sorrell (48:34):
Yeah. Great. Wrap up, but I do have another question. . Yes,
Nicole Hill (48:38):
Go for it. .
Scott Sorrell (48:39):
So you mentioned before, sorry, Stacy you, you gave us number one, two, and three. What was the last three?
Nicole Hill (48:47):
Okay, the last three I think if I'm remembering off the top of my head insect proteins, so specifically cicada and Cricut were in that bottom tier. I don't remember the exact order but I remember Cricut and Cicada were, were fairly low black soldier fly larva, I think was the bottom salting insects. And cultivated meat was, you know, at the top of the bottom, if that makes sense. Yeah, got it. So there were still people who were interested in open to sampling something. Yeah. But there was also put, and again, these are US consumers, so there's a, a, a different mentality around insects being consumed by themselves. And we talk about the human humanization of pets. So likewise, that transfers to pet. So while there was still more positive willingness to try, there was also a larger number of folks who had a negative feeling like I would be less likely to purchase something if it were made with an insect protein or even we also evaluated an invasive rodent species nutri.
Nicole Hill (49:55):
And even that, when you say invasive rodent there's a rodent, a high rodent, yeah, a high, a bit of a turn off of people, negative correlation with, with that as with insect and cultivated meat. So as brands look into those spaces, one, like truly look at what is the market opportunity, but two you know, there is a place for niche players and innovation in any category, but make sure if you do decide to go down that path, you are talking to the audience who is interested and open to that and don't waste your energy on necessarily consumers that are out of the gate, like hard. No, you really need to when you're introducing anything new, anything, anything novel, start with those who are most open to considering it most interested, most willing, and then see, you know, how you can potentially grow the market from there.
Scott Sorrell (50:48):
Seems like there's a strong correlation between what I personally would not eat .
Nicole Hill (50:52):
Yeah, no, that's what it is. There, there really is. I will say that in Cat we see more openness to insect proteins. Okay. But if you also think like, what do, what do cats do for fun? Sometimes they're, they're catching a fly or a cricket. So maybe people have a more comfort with feeding their cat something they see their cat kind of go after in the wild, so to speak.
Scott Sorrell (51:12):
Yeah. Interesting topic. I have a feeling we'll be talking about this again next year, Nicole, but thank you for your time course. You guys have been great guests. Appreciate your time. Appreciate your expertise to our loyal audience out there. Thank you again for coming along on this this journey. I hope you learned something. We hope you had some fun and I hope to see you next time here at Real Science Exchange, where it's always happy hour and you're always among friends.
Speaker 6 (51:35):
We'd love to hear your comments or ideas for topics and guests. So please reach out via email@anh.marketing at balchem.com with any suggestions, and we'll work hard to add them to the schedule. Don't forget to leave a five star rating on your way out. You can request your Real Science Exchange t-shirt in just a few easy steps, just like or subscribe to the Real Science Exchange. And send us a screenshot along with your address and t-shirt size to anh.marketing at balchem.com. Balchems real science lecture series of webinars takes place on the first Tuesday of every month with the top research and nutrition topics that will impact your business. We also include small ruminant, monogastric, and companion animal focused topics throughout the year. Visit biochem.com/real science to see the upcoming topics and to register for future webinars. You can also access past webinars and search for the topics most important to you.